In this episode I’m joined by a passionate advocate and activist for sex workers’ rights. Dave in Phoenix has been on the front lines of the prostitution decriminalization movement for a long time and has great insights to share about the Phoenix Goddess Temple case and much more.
Please visit his website at:
- the story of liberated christians
- swing conventions in the 90s
- “onward christian swingers” new times
- the issue of single men in poly/swinger groups and the argument for sex workers
- the history of the Phoenix Goddess Temple
- Dave’s views on sexuality, religion, and law
- the need for legal healing, massage, and touch
- concerned about prostitution laws
- “felony criminal enterprise” much higher
crime than just prostitution which is just
- testing the viability suggested donation vs. a fee arrangement for a sex act
- historical overview of Canadian prostitution laws
- in-private consenting adult sex work vs
- beyond the myth that all prostitutes are forced into it
- how escort agencies bend the law
- harm reduction
- Canadian charter of rights and freedoms
- in current U.S. legal climate, escorts being assaulted by bag clients can’t help each other and are more afraid of the policy than bad clients
- challenge to California prostitution laws
- Sex Workers Outreach Project
- Alternative funding models for sex “volunteers”
- the grey area of sugar daddies and friends with benefits
- the potential and precedents for a club/membership model
- the commonality of prostitution in the times of the bible
- patriarchal double standards of adultery
- thoughts on bonobos and the myth of monogamy
- my prayers for Tracy who I interviewed in this episode: https://tantrapunk.com/taking-a-stand-for-sacred-sexuality-with-tracy-elise-tpp36
I come from a very conservative background. 20+ years ago I was very active in evangelical, conservative ministries, including Bible Study Fellowship, Christian Business Men’s Committee, as well as serving as deacon in a conservative Presbyterian Church. For many years I believed in the inerrant word of God–God said it and that settles it.
But I met a couple where both husband and wife were going to Lutheran Theological Seminary to be ministers. They started pointing out how in Hebrew and Greek there were obvious contradictions in scripture and some things I thought were crystal clear were quite foggy. Being interested in supporting my conservative beliefs concerning sexuality, I set out to do more research to prove my position correct that sex was wrong unless you were married and then only with your wife. I read many books by theologians and those that were experts in Greek and Hebrew and slowly, over time, I found the evidence was overwhelming that I had been very wrong in my traditional beliefs. I became very upset that the church would mistranslate and misapply the bible to promote an agenda, which was not based on the original biblical texts.
In the mid 1980’s I attended many Stan Dale’s Human Awareness Institute’s “Sex, Love and Intimacy” workshops in Calif., where I learned and experienced the group dynamics of true love, intimacy and fulfilling sexuality far beyond just thrusting intercourse. While these groups were often closer to New Age type beliefs, I saw more Christ like love than what I had ever experienced in the traditional church. Too often the church is too busy reaching UP to God to reach OUT to each other. There are more people in the world starving for love and affection than starving for food, but when it comes to meaningful intimate interaction, the church is too often “God’s Frozen People.”
In my childhood I was very shy. I was scared of women and didn’t date till I was a senior in college. I never went to a dance. But gradually I became more outgoing and married. But more than 20 years ago, after being resingled, I was insecure and depressed. Many women reacted negatively to me, sensing neediness and insecurity. But slowly, over time, after experience the Stan Dale workshops, some sex surrogacy training, Esalen massage training and lots of G-spot massage experience I found women strangely attracted to me…especially once they started to experience my touch. For many years I thought all men were naturally, wonderfully intimate and I was just far behind. But so many women started telling me they had seldom experienced men with good touch and intimacy skills and I began to wonder why. I have concluded that many men want to be more intimate but haven’t learned how.
Example: A couple had me do Esalen massage on the women. After a while the man came upstairs to see how we were doing and got turned on seeing his nude girlfriend on my table. He jumped in wanting to be sexual with her. As he was poking and groping her body parts he asked how things were going. She replied “Great until you came up”. Sometimes honest communications can be embarrassing but he did get the message that at that time she wanted the intimacy of massage not poking and groping.
On the other hand, not everyone is going to become interested in real intimacy. Being intimate is much more threatening and difficult for many than just having recreational sex with strangers. But for me I don’t enjoy sex without intimacy, but often enjoy intimacy even without sex. My purpose is to show the various sexual intimacy options so people can relate to whatever they choose is most fulfilling for them.
I enjoy physical intimacy with a wide variety of women who also enjoy good touch, cuddling, massage, caressing etc. I have lots of ideas for more intimacy based on many years of teaching intimacy workshops for couples, counseling many couples as well as hearing from a huge number of men that are seeking more intimacy from sex workers. I have been a speaker at national swing conventions hosted massage rooms and led the Phoenix Couples Group that had 350 participants. I have been professionally trained and teach Esalen massage, which many women have enjoyed. I offer free massage to sex workers/dancers/massage therapists. Or, I offer what I call a non-sexual cuddle and caress experience so many women enjoy. Yes, I also enjoy sex but not “just sex” without intimacy with the great sex.
One of the problems I face in dating many “normal” women is that as one said, “I am looking for a man who values monogamy as much as I do.” The problem is they only see cheating as the alternative to monogamy. But because I have such different views, finding like minded single women is very hard. Obviously sex workers often face the same issues in their own personal relationships.
In this episode I interview Tracy Elise the founder of the Phoenix Goddess Temple. She is defending herself in a historic trial and facing multiple felony charges. She tells her story of providing non-profit sacred sexual healing services, offering spiritual initiation and training, and being persecuted for her religious beliefs and practices.
To help support her legal defense efforts please visit:
For a glimpse at the temple arts please watch and share this video: