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Operational Security in the Age of Grand Theft Crypto with Vin Armani TPP170


In this episode I’m joined again by the illustrious Vin Armani for an instructive session on operational security for cryptocurrency users. We outline and cover the basics and address advanced concepts in a down to earth and accessible way. There are gems of wisdom that will educate and empower beginners and advanced users alike.

Please visit Vin’s website at http://vinarmani.com/

About Vin:
Vin Armani is a philosopher, serial tech entrepreneur, and CryptoSavage. He is the host of The Vin Armani Show on Activist Post. In addition to being an author and speaker, he has made his living as a television star, film producer, high-end male escort, software developer, art gallerist, pirate radio station operator, DJ, music producer, and motorcycle courier. He studied Philosophy at Howard University.

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Tantra Punk your guide to sexual Liberation healing and empowerment as a certified Tantra counselor and certified permaculture designer I’m here to help you grow spiritually sexually and ecologically my online and in-person counseling sessions and training programs are price to fit any budget I’m looking forward to helping you design and ever more Divine Life Path please send me an email to Ben at Tantra Punk. Com and our journey together will begin I love your beloved’s welcome to Township Punk podcast episode number 170 I am here again with vin Armani and we’re going to get very practical we’ve done a lot of really deep in esoteric podcast in the past so this will be I believe number for end of an ongoing series we really got into some deep material and this is definitely one that says still abstract probably for some people who aren’t really deeply living in the sort of Matrix and the way that we are and the crypto space but this is I believe it going to be a public service for those who are crypto curious or who have some skin in the game and want to keep it safe and we’re going to talk about what is often termed operational security for having a lifestyle that’s that’s starting to become your own bank in about people say happy your own bank will you better also you can do that if you want to get a Lambo after they become their own bank but I’d rather get an armored car lose it all so yeah we’re going to get into just some of the best practices some of the no some V the jargon but keep it very 101 level if we can and bring in some personal experiences and anecdotes and so yeah what that said then thank you so much again for joining us and if you could just tell us yeah give us an update on what’s going on with you and then we can LSU LSU rip on this on this topic cuz I know you got a lot to say sure thanks for having me back I’ve just been I really just been hard at work grinding away on a on a whole new version of software for my company coin text we took a nice round of seed funding and we took it in cryptocurrency so this is a very apropos I mean we’ve got a significant War chest that we are having to keep safe ourselves with our operational security and then of course Star product we do have some proprietary information that we also have to be very very careful with and that that we got to put into a situation with that were anything to happen to any of us Founders that we that the other ones would be able to to pick it up so this is a friend of mine for me right now and so yeah it’s cool it’s it’s it’s something that’s very very it’s it’s always fun to talk about especially at a high-level like a as you say like a 101 sort of level I think that there’s within the crypto space there’s definitely some people who fetishize operational security and I think that’s fantastic one thing that we should say going into this so so what is operational security this is keeping your information your money yourself safe and secure and there are a lot of facets to that most people don’t need a level of operational security that is at the level that you would need if you were a politician or Diplomat or a significantly Rich wealthy individual my youngest brother is actually a bodyguard private Executive Security for one of the in the top 20 richest individuals on the planet so he and I talked about this stuff quite a bit it’s super interesting but most people still have a need especially if you’re going to move into the crypto space a lot of people who have not had a lot of experience with dealing in cash I mean those people are paid and you know they work a job that paid either a check or there they get it direct deposited into their account and the bank takes on a lot of responsibility in terms of you know they’re going to be Mercy with you have fraud on your account if you get your card stolen they’re going to replace that for you and shut off the account and they’re going to handle a lot of operational security Now part of the promise of Bitcoin from the beginning from the white paper was that the idea is to remove those trusted third parties from out of the mix now you get a lot there’s a lot of benefits by removing those trusses third parties because those trusses third parties are the banks and in this day and age there’s very little separation between the banks and the state there’s kind of a revolving door with regulatory capture so you remove the bank’s you remove the state you get a lot more financial sovereignty but with financial solvency comes the responsibility of taking care of your own operational security because no one else is going to do it for you so we’ve got you sent me over this is this is really awesome that you put this put together a sort of on a map of things to talk about in terms of operational security I think you’ve got him handled do you then want to go over sort of what you had in mind a place to start and then we’ll just jump in at each other at each individual place that sounds great yeah and thank you for providing that intro that was so accessible and I feel like the grandmas that we want to use non-custodial wallets could all Beach standing up and cheering right now just hearing what you just said because you’re also giving a little bit of credit to the systems that we rely on or support so it shows a well-balanced prospective you get a lot of will you know I love one of my favorite economics quotes is Thomas Sowell and he says in economics there are no Solutions only trade-offs and so you should never think that crypto is a solution in and of itself there is a series of trade-offs and I think that to be responsible in moving into this new space we have to be honest about not just what the positive trade-offs are but also what some of the costs are or some of the things that we potentially are losing in terms of convenience and in terms of security that we because then we can make up the difference right so at least we go into it with our eyes wide open absolutely absolutely very nice to point there and yeah I guess I was just say for myself a little bit of background I’m not I’m not in a paid position as a security professional but in the office environments and corporate environments in other sort of associations that I have I have attempted to in my step up into that role and have a sort of try to be a fly on the wall or have some have my ear to the door on the security professional space and 10 years ago there weren’t that many podcast when I started getting it is now there’s a whole bunch of them and I kind of elapsed on my being really focused on this stuff but one wants to get back in the car once I got into crypto I got back into looking at what are the pentesters doing what are these professional groups that are actually doing with skull penetration testing and they’re actually hired like in that movie sneakers with Robert Redford which is a a Prelude to the entire crypto Revolution that were in right now and it goes back to the crypto Wars and I’ve just wrecked my gutter recommend that for anybody if you want to get that do stuff with that sort of phone techno sci-fi thriller you know that I sent him by then watch that movie sneakers from the early 90s cuz it puts they was prophecy for right now so I just want to throw that out there that I’m not I get a professional here but what I’m trying to do is be a bridge between lay folks and people my loved ones and myself and the very technical computer science now of protecting what you have and then we say it’s the Wild West in October in the wild west if you had a six-shooter you pretty much we’re okay to protect your your winnings at the casino and your gold and your your lady and your horse and whatever else but now you know you got to be a multi-dimensional ninja and have a sense of this jargon and stuff so I’m just going to lay out a little bit of the sort of this mind map that has some dragon in it but stuff that you were super well-versed in so you would have a better handle on bringing it down to Earth are people so you know I think we can start with just looking at his concept of threat modeling which is if you if you have a few interests and a business model you’re looking at your your risks your opportunities that the competitors in the market place that markets there’s a there’s always things we take for granted about business modeling will part of that risk assessment part of a business or your personal life is to look at what is water in your line of work and your lifestyle like you said if you’re not super rich you’re not a politician you probably have you know somewhere along Joe sixpack to maybe not all the way to Zuckerberg with something in between where you’re trying to deal with you know that what is typical for you and your life your station in life and I just broke it down into three broad categories that you can zoom in to in for this its malice negligence and in the case of crypto its regulatory so what are the threats coming at most of us people who are trying to hurt us take something from us manipulators make a new trolls makes Michael Apso without drilling down into that would you say we’re all facing that thread there’s always people who are who are coming at us with malice and then there’s a whole nother Spear of the threats that are just negligence you know that could be in Mentone on crypto Digital Life just a drunk driver or whatever you know any said negligence is people who are doing our intended harm to you and then I think a combination of both if I can put on my valise and negligence you get radio I think that’s right who in crypto you know what we’ll get into that but it’s like that that’s it right there so and then just to give you a maybe how about let’s just do this one more time so before I give away to reveal the cards of the other two broad categories here we’ll just let you go yeah go off on what comes to mind for you with malice negligence and Regulatory threats as a crypto user and developer so I think for most people malice is 4 / most average people out there malice is actually going to be your your number one concern but your concern although I’ll give you a little a little story here and this is this is one where I failed I think it’s kind of always good to to share when where you failed that the simple one that could happen to could really have happened to anybody and it illustrates that even with the best of intentions you can blow it with operational security so several years ago this is probably five six years ago I was going to go and do what was going to be my first ayahuasca ceremony and for anybody who’s gone through that process like you don’t know what’s coming and I’m somebody who out you know I’m always hoping for the best but preparing for the worst and the woman that I was seeing at the time I was living with her I was like I’m going off I’m going to go off and I’m going to do this ayahuasca ceremony and I’m going to leave you just in case something happens who know right so I wrote down on a piece of paper I said here are my passwords here’s the combination to my safe like here are all of these things just in case something were to happen to me hear the phone numbers that you should call whatever and I left this piece of paper with her actually I actually had left it in my closet and you know I didn’t really think about it the ceremony great I’d eventually a couple days later went and saw the piece of paper was in the same place took it like ripped it up through it through it in the toilet flush the toilet gone it was probably I don’t know about a year later we had broken up and I was doing my own thing living in another place already dating someone else and happened to run into a mutual friend of mine who seemed very sort of frantic when she saw she saw me a mutual friend of myself in my ex she was like oh my God I didn’t have your number I didn’t know what to do about this you have to know that your ex has access to your email and has been reading it this whole time she knows everything that’s been going on with you she’s been doing her best to try to like it like stepping between she’s been doing all this weird stuff in the background with a girl that you’re like dating now she’s trying to like mess all these things have been like oh my God and I thought to myself right I’m like how the hell does she have access and then it occurred to me oh yeah I had written that thing down so she had gone and written it all down now who knows who knows whether you know probably at the time she probably thought that she had like the best of intentions like oh just in case right or maybe not but that created that situation and particularly there was some business deals that we’re going on at the time it it really luckily luckily nothing you know terrible came of it and I was able to go through and and look and actually did see I wanted to Google it was a my Gmail account I went in to Google so we’ll security thing and did see that their identities other logins which is something that I advise everybody to check periodically that’s one of the easiest things that you can do for your operational security I know that you can set it so that alerts will come be sure that that’s set especially if you have an Android phone it’ll come right to your phone saying that another that an unknown device is trying to login be sure to have that that’s what that’s what just one small thing that that is very helpful so so this was one where malice came into play much later so it is to say that sometimes a mistake that you make at one point can pop-up much much much later so that’s that’s a story about malice and it’s one where it’s like think about that before you give away passwords you know codes to your phone all of these things and if you do something so so what would the moral of the story of Ben for me what I should have done is in that scenario every single one of those things that I had written down and turn the password and everything I should have changed them immediately so if you ever did write them down and give them to somebody that for some sort of situation like that if it’s I mean that’s perhaps inappropriate situation to be doing that in what I should have done as I should have as soon as I came back I should have changed them all everything you know what does that actually and I also another and I love that story and I’m going to actually follow that up with some stuff you’re going to love to have sex so appropriate for the for the the erotic nature of this podcast listenership for sure so we’re going to make the sexy and fun don’t worry that is the sexiest and most fun way to approach operation security is of course in relationships for the worst forms of malice can occur so okay so practically speaking because people there’s this sort of I mean it’s like they say dentist what is it Mirror Maze I can’t remember the list of the professions that have the highest suicide rate because people hate them or don’t take him seriously and I think security Chief security officers has got to be on that list because nobody listens to you know I listen to them and they are just sitting there end of the first ones to get fired when something goes wrong even though they warned everybody so because people are so resistant to best practices from Security Professionals that tell him you and please don’t give me you know your dog’s name password that you have for your bank and everything else cuz I just want to go in and update your WordPress the best thing that I would say to them is that okay temporarily change your password and if you don’t know how to create a secondary admin you know account on whatever it is they were working on then you change that password temporarily give me the change password and then as soon as the job is done you change it back to whatever you want and I don’t ever see or no I don’t want that liability so two-year Point absolutely that is the solution of that is there are times when you’re going to have to do exactly what you said and you know that sin if we can’t tell me also is that you remember the movie Casino I’m sure where it is like I remember it was just when you said that the line that came to me was from what is when he said you know if you love someone the trust him with everything otherwise what’s the point in the whole movie was based around how pretty much tea crave that safe-deposit box with a Shakedown money and she had was the only other person if you get in there to spend it and she get broken and used it to pay the old girl temp that is something to remember also about operational security that your security is immediately suspect it’s not fully compromised but you should consider it a you should consider it a major major threat if as soon as you share secure information with another individual so if you want to have real operational security I think an aunt again it’s you know I see so many people who give over there you know their codes to their their phones and all of this to two significant other and what not their pins to their bank accounts you know keys to an access to two other accounts these are all situations where it doesn’t it and we’ll get into this a little further but it’s like you in many ways are also putting them at risk when you do that especially if you do it unnecessarily right and you should always assume that although they may be completely benign at this point that in the future there is the possibility that this other individual who you can’t control who you don’t know what they’re doing 24/7 that that individual is going to to actually become a potentially a n attack surface themselves and so Emma and will get into that so I mean that’s that’s either through malice or that’s all through also through negligence right so that kind of leaves into the negligence as well because it’s like while you may be completely fastidious about what you do in terms of your operational security if any part of that you delegate to someone else or you share with someone else in a way that they can compromise it you don’t know if they’re going to be negligent or not like you don’t know what could possibly happen and so you want to maintain as much control as you possibly can now the interesting thing like what at what I do believe about maintaining control is that the best way to maintain control in this day and age is physically and the highest level security systems so you’re talking about like security systems that are like you know control nuclear launches or nuclear energy sites things that you know infectious diseases all of this all of those systems are all air-gapped that’s one of the things that they do with all of those systems and what are Gap means is that there’s no way for you to get from the internet to that system that system completely disconnected from the internet and completely disconnected from any internet-connected device and so that’s always going to be in this day and age your your safest bet and so it’s under your control disconnected from the internet where you can have some idea of where it is 24/7 that’s going to definitely mitigate negligence and then regulatory yeah this one in crypto is a tough one and it it requires constant learning I’ve actually I actually was schooled by my attorney now that we have a corporate attorney recently in terms of how I had thought that the government was handling and and and funny enough that this is like something that even people that I know who have been in crypto for a long time who guys who won ATM machines and what not clear on how the financial crimes enforcement Network which is fincen which are the ones who are really the the main people who crack down and turns of crypto exchange and and what not like unregistered money service businesses and why not how they work and how they’re handling cryptocurrency exchanges in and most people had thought that it fell under a a a foreign exchange law but come to find out fence and it doesn’t actually fall into foreign exchange law Dave Dave said themselves well know the foreign exchange while I was only a few or an exchanger of one currency of a country for another currency of a country so clearly and didn’t send says this themselves they say no it’s it’s it’s not that what we think it is and how we regulated as we regulated as a money transfer which is essentially like Western Union or MoneyGram or something like that it’s the law says that it’s someone who takes money from one person and then sends it on behalf of that person to another person and that it also says or to another location and so basically how they look at it is if I’ve if I take you no cash from you and then I send my Bitcoin aunt at I broadcast a transaction on to the blockchain they say well I didn’t give it to you I sent it to another location and so that’s money transfer and so this is how they are trying to you know crack down on people who are doing either ATMs without money service business license or hand-to-hand exchange is like with localbitcoins they’re having a very difficult time actually Prosecuting these things but what they are doing and it’s something for people to watch out for I think it’s still relatively safe to do localbitcoins but how they are getting people is they will if they’re just going off of greed they will say hey I want to buy $50,000 worth of bitcoin from you and those guys like okay sweet I want to do that I’ve got I’ve got it want to help you out and then they show up and before they do the exchange they say a man you know I’m glad that I could get these Bitcoin because I’ve got this big heroin deal that and you know he only take Bitcoin and glad you were here man and maybe we could do this in the future in the guy goes yeah sure no problem that’s how they got Charlie shrem how they got that’s how they get them all that’s how they get them all is an cuz of that becomes money laundering money laundry so you’re aware or that you have any knowledge that anything illegal to be having a sick note unless you’re buying Bibles for the mission in South America you are going to jail so this is so this actually has a parallel in the escort world and that is that it is completely legal to contract for time and companionship but the same way that they get escorts is the person shows up and they say yeah want to make sure like because I you know I’m very picky can I get XYZ right specific things and then if the the person who’s there is like oh yeah sure no problem and then they give them the money boom your pops so so what it comes down to is if you’re going to do exchanges with strangers of cash for crypto if they said just like if you’re an escort and they mention anything sexual other than you know and if anything other than time and companionship you just walk right out same sort of situation you just walk right out and you’re fine it’s no problem crypto entrapment and now it’s like you have all these at least these hilarious cultural memes around what Undercovers do at parties and stuff so now you just pretty much laid out how what is the crypto undercover sting operation guy look like a gal who can they go to a meet up and they are localbitcoins and they they would approach you like that in this is pretty much a some kind of entrapment that’s some serious you know what at their minds me for that people who are Tantra Savvy and remember the Phoenix goddess temple one of the operation that they did they came in and they would have undercover officers they called it operation goddess Temple a 6-month surveillance operation where they end in i interview Tracy on this pod Preston she said they would come in there is one guy came in there and said I want to take to get it to get a quote Fior rangement for sexual acts that would be entrapment she said he came in there any said I want to put my caca in your vagina, oh my God I want to not in court but it reminds me of that was that movie at a Tarantino one where they had that you got to be naturalistic as hell that. So anyway so K I was dead guessing but yeah that’s that’s this is so it at somebody in California a woman got popped for localbitcoins operating basic buy a localbitcoins operation running that kind of business so it’s it’s a trip though because you have The Regulators fighting over whether or not it’s a commodity or a currency in which case is kind of like well can I choose which which one of the Hammers is going to come down on me I’d rather be blessed for the money transfer thing though is very very broad so whether it’s a commodity whether it’s currency it literally says anything that substitutes for for Value. That that that substitutes for like money in any way this is what fence and they put out specific guidance on this saying this is how we’re handling it now another thing to think about when you’re talkin about regulatory is will the first thing is this the operating as an unlicensed money service business is very serious it’s the maximum penalty is 5 years in federal prison so it’s a very very serious it’s something that people should before you if you’re going to go out and think that you’re going to start exchanging crypto for cash as a business you really need to think about that the other thing to keep in mind is even though you may be cool under federal law with a federal law says is that if you are if you break State money service business law if you immediately become liable for the penalties under the federal so if you are fine under Federal but you’ve done something and all 50 states have to have different regulations so if you’ve done something wrong under the state regulation that’s just your going to get the state penalty and you’re going to be liable for the federal penalty as well now you’ve got States like New Hampshire that have specifically Exempted cryptocurrency from from money transfer and also if you are just selling a cryptocurrency hand-to-hand I actually have a letter from the banking Commission on their letterhead and all that in there like we so long as you are you know operating under best business practices as any other business we do not regulate that so in one of the few states where it’s cool on a Stateside but you see I mean you’re still liable for the Fed so it’s just that’s just something for people to keep in mind the state is always your biggest threat so before you go into you know before you go into any business in this regard definitely go and get some legal counsel look over the statutes read every single thing that you can and if there’s anything that seems unclear I really talk to a professional in that regard so that’s I just just want to say that that’s really important yeah thank you so much and anybody who’s paying attention to even just the headlines in crypto it’s it’s just the shitshow with all of this regulation although there are some allies for sure you know Wyoming Nevada New Hampshire is going to have to be a crypto what are the free state movement for crypto doubt that semi maybe it’s going to take that Meme and just brought in it and just be like go to a stronghold and do the regulatory Arbitrage Boogie you know sure for sure I mean that really the free state project is very proud of what’s happened in terms of crypto here in New Hampshire and I mean that’s the reason why I’m here it’s the reason why we why we decided to basecoin text here it’s just it clears up a lot man it really it really does it’s just that whole level of Regulation that we don’t even really have to worry about so I do think that there’s eventually it it just makes sense that there would be a crypto Silicon Valley or Wall Street I mean they have what they call Valley in Zurich Switzerland but I think it probably will have to be in the US side I mean the US is just the biggest market for all of this and of course the most important financial markets in the world are here in the US so you know if we’re going to break the dollar it’s going to be it’s going to be here for sure right on man yeah well thank you so much and I I know is that I had I’ve always I’ve often wondered since hearing about it you know what what that trade-off process was for you to leave Vegas and go there and you know you have the means I’m sure that will just live as many days of the year in Vegas if you want and still be a resident there but it’s not like I like somebody who they’re they’re never looking back to where their Hometown was when they get a job bus you know somewhere else but but I do appreciate that and that’s a bold move and believe me I fantasize about a dream about it and part of my soul is already prospecting over looking for property over there but but yeah man so something I will have to The Departed especially cuz you brought up the the Ayahuasca part one of the episodes I did in the past episode number 126 was called decrypting the cyberdelic revolution with the Renzo Haggerty and he is the host of the Psychedelic Salon podcast and he has a really solid Tech and internet background that you can hear all about in that in that podcast but one of the things he said I want of his podcast was that he was talking about the the shaman Tony Moss who is outspoken Iowa’s modern sort of Ayahuasca Shaman and he said you know Lorenzo said about him I trust I would trust him with my root password any day so be careful who you share that with but yeah if you’re an interesting about the ceremony still cuz I thought you were actually going to go in the direction of like yeah I thought I was going into a really well vetted Shaman and then I ended up giving my my soul’s root password up to someone who had had a strong opsec in that regard will have to get into that I think we’ve got into a bit of that before we get on another episode ahead of us so back up. Yeah yeah thank you for all the stuff I think that was really really key material for no pun intended for the regulatory stuff anybody thinking about you know what your responsibilities is and then even just maybe something to the tax liability is something to add to that with if you have thoughts on that with them you haven’t been talking about that or just where you thinking about okay if you now when I think about I used to just want to give away crypto or get friends involving up and now I feel like oh my God every time I drop one Satoshi gun to someone else’s wallet they now have a tax liability that could get them in trouble later so I’m wondering a little bit so just to understand what that is the idea behind capital gains tax in and I believe that on crypto it is 21% I believe don’t don’t quote me on this and it’s also so basically what it is is that if you’ve held for the basically for over 12 months usually is what it is this time may may vary depending upon what your jurisdiction is it when it comes to capital gains but the idea behind capital gains is if you let’s say you bought at 1000 and you sold at 3000 you had $2,000 worth of capital games in terms of the value of the capital that you had one and so therefore you are ostensibly you’re liable for that capital gains now where this gets a little gray into the gray area and there’s a lot of gray areas in crypto is I can see it now and this is just people just got to know and got to get the word out and start building yeah I’m almost filling my gas tank to start driving out there right now either way I can guess it’s a people have been wanting you know it’s been it’s been on my not just a to-do list but actually really it’s it’s it’s the lot a lot of the stuff is is I can see it happening and also I have to if it’s not already being taken for some other obviously a worthy cause I feel like the love Free or Die state is going to be the hashtag that I don’t know how to set up with a handle on that it’s all you it’s you if you can take that and run with it if she if it works but I feel like that’s good Hello Google it’s the birthday I feel like you have a lot of love like a lot of love yeah I know I feel it I feel I feel you said you were a Healer and you seem you seem like very empathetic yeah this won’t this to me you know all of the trauma that I have witnessed that I’ve experienced ice I can imagine that this would be a place for people to better and I literally I mean you know they call it an adult industry we say that you’re a civilian if you’re not in front of the UNIF you’re not in front of the camera at doing this stuff for on the street or wherever you’re a civilian and so if that’s the case which I really truly believe it is then we need to have VA programs in hospitals in Reno and benefits and we’re doing a public service for helping leaving out everyone’s fantasies for them if they don’t have the courage or the resources to make them happen so for that I like to be treated with this much if not you know as much love and respect and dignity and resources as Veterans of violence and brutality and warfare. civilians is military yeah, that’s cool yeah and we aren’t we aren’t we you know and you know we were lying about reliving some sort of childhood, it wasn’t about servitude or Surrender sometimes it was just the process to the session would be the process to get to the Aftercare to get to that hug to get to that approval like being told you did a good job you know and when I realize that I thought there’s so much more I’ve actually I’ve had plenty of clients for a while there it was kind of weird they were widows widowers their wearers like I was attacking little words that were in various ways and people don’t understand that Sexual Energy can be incredibly therapeutic and healing you know when there’s something fundamentally wrong with that especially you know I mean now I mean Dairy mention you know I mean every day and I just kept having these handmade in handmaid’s tale things going through my mind and and now to be apart of Swap and to be keto on the inside track knowing what’s going on with this legislation here to decriminalize effort I am filled with hope and love all over again no more despair or fear I feel like this could really I meant to be alive right now at this time and to be here and now in this state I feel very very honored and lucky absolutely why I feel very honored and lucky that we are having this conversation you were exactly the voice of the representative that I wanted to find and connect with its in this is really an amazing amazing invigorating conversation and I just I just want to thank you again so much and you know we’ve got a little bit of time left I think we covered most of what I was super excited and looking forward to discussing I guess I would like to ask if you want to talk about the kind of support that you need from people in the area from people abroad people anywhere in the world listening to this but what what do you need to help your chapter really get to the to the point where were you have all your dreams are coming true and you know you have the people power and the skill sets what were you what are your pain points and what do you need so that that can just be put out there and it is a prayer absolutely absolutely awesome and I’m sex worker Outreach project is a nonprofit we do accept donations we accept recurring donations donations I mean just to be an ally to a sex worker to be supportive and you know aware that their work is real work and emotionally laboring work to know the sex work as a form of emotional and physical labor and that nobody story is is representative of all sex where you know and I think that the presence of sex workers in social movement come together and try to fight this and you have to fight what gone but it is a tubal refuse up sex workers bank accounts and it’s happened the money seems suspicious that’s unacceptable yeah yeah that’s you that’s the way to to bypass So Many Factors whether it’s the pimp violence or the banks or the state or even Amazon not wanting your wishlist to be you know used for compensation whatever it is the terms that you have to been in bed will I have to say that the my biggest public service announcement for anybody that might be in your network who listens to this is that I really hope that anyone listening who is a sex worker who has the u.s. exposed to these Financial choke point issues invest time in studying the whole cryptocurrency movement starting with Bitcoin and in aetherium but but you can accelerate that process if you start to look into joining the platform of spankchain which is bringing together all of the activism all of the the really Advanced cryptocurrency solutions for being your own bank literally being your own bank where you have peer-to-peer Financial transactions you can sell they will be yeah they will be providing a lot of solutions for the industry and for the producers and performers to be empowered independently and off the rails of the money system we don’t need to do our dirty work without your dirty Fiat is how I feel McGregor’s Outreach project we have like a meme donation thing you can donate cooked difference NFL Karma Dakshin and and how how sex workers are the difference between trafficking educate yourself some people have been looking for what seems like an ideal future to me or all of the the glory and the beauty of the healing in the transformation that is possible and also the the sort of in the streets marches and the activism going to take to get there and a couple of I guess you’re silly but up at the memes have come to me and one is it you know people I remember chanting in the streets protesting Wars and logging and you all kinds of pollution would not the people we would always chant whose streets are our streets and I can hear this echoing Cruise sheets are seeds coming out with our seats and then you can also got allies and civilians involved right thing that ever since I started looking into it swapped but I’ve ever felt like we’ll all of the the Financial Funding necessary to do real political work lobbying in legislation and all that stuff I feel like there’s got to be a way to solicit the the buyers of sex work the purchasers of the material that the funeral of the client’s right of the clients are you so mean maybe PornHub can put a donate button to swap you know somewhere I mean set stuff like that I would love to see the financing for all of the stuff that you have in your bucket list of dreams to make come true for this industry and for this movement that that the money if the people who can afford to pay for their further their fetish or for their experience or for their media everybody and you know what I mean I come from the the green business Eco business startup kind of seen in in LA and it was a no-brainer that you would want to launch your startup having a dollar of every purchase or a percentage of your purpose so that you could have the the pr potential of putting out press releases were you talk about how you give back as a social impact or I mean even PornHub has done a lot of cool stuff like that and I don’t mean to keep harping on them but because they’re the biggest conglomerate really that the industry absolutely and you know that they’re behind them right that I was either going to let my contact continue to be over there in cream to the channel myself because it because you know we can continue and have more follow-ups to this conversation but I certainly would love to explore some of your insights in the industry and I have some yes yeah I wanted to add you know how that Whole Foods you know if you have to you have to be a squeaky wheel gets the grease and House of weird that you were is this is thrilling to me I know that there’s a there’s worse things in the world than having pornstars solicit you on your doorstep like door-to-door canvassing for help me on Monday to take your singing telegrams you know what the my name is you could use the conservative rhetoric against him and say we’re here to clean up the adult industry sign here and give us a check what do you mean well I know where else next workers never would never when they used to pack meat and the muckrakers had to blow the whistle and that’s how we have ratio any conservative how do I I subscribed to say the r word regulation but I will say any sort of public outcry about working conditions that’s all we need you know and Industry within the industry of people like you who know what performers need what the issues are and can represent that and it’s not coming top down it’s not coming from you know sideswiping from weird organizations with too much money trying to push agendas where they don’t belong and some people know what I’m talking about there and some people don’t but it’s what they did with the keywords you know trafficking of course people wanted to sign off on that piece of aeon I support you know anti-trafficking laws of course I do and so what we could do is we could eat give them a dose of their own medicine like you said hi we’re going to clean up your industry and fine hair like that cuz that’s how they do so many things when they say you know that people don’t read the fine print when they when they sign initiatives to get on the ballot you know they read the sort of sensationalist headline that skews the facts to some moral kind of you get boxed in Morley by the by the by the headline of whatever it is and so that it’s it’s like appealing to logical fallacies for anyone to want to do that but yeah I mean this is really it’s actually truly the holiest and most most sort of medic there’s there’s a way for all of the people to I mean excellent performance have the legal space to do this right then then the medical aspect will I think it’s going to naturally organically become a safer environment if you’re not having to be underground in the hide from you know the the filming commission and fucking cops and at the neighbors and you could actually have facilities that work up Captain staff and you know and fungus were like just clean to the places I mean that’s what people say about the all of those secondary crime things that go along with Vice and things being underground and the black market economy you know if when you when you legalize drugs all of those secondary cramps go away and so this is a war on sex and we need to end the war on drugs and the war on sex and these problems will sell themselves in the free market so it’s going to happen New Hampshire you know get ready full medical benefits of cannabis right and I’m actually is for you I think what will happen is that is that is that the Cheeto person will get a reverse gangbang by a bunch of Tantra see the goddess and he will want to transform United States into one giant orgiastic goddess Temple to heal the planet from all the patriarchy that’s my that’s my vote I’m going to put that are you trying to turn me on now I try I try not to but sometimes I can’t help it it just happens thank you for that well yeah so we it’s been one of the most delightful hours of my life at sharing this time with you and I’d like to ask you now to give us the links to everything that you want to share and that you’re involved with and close this out with some final words calls-to-action slogans from the front lines whatever you like to share please take your time. Thank you it’s been an honor and I’m I’m I’m pretty sure my cheeks are going to hurt from smiling too so that’s as wot USA. O r g basically you where you can find me I just would like to do everything I can and vegetation Security building in Albuquerque beautiful thank you awesome alright I see well yeah let’s let’s call it a podcast and let’s be in touch and I will I will be in touch again very soon thank you so much and have a wonderful evening. Smiley and you’re coming over here thank you for listening to the touch upon podcast please go to www.crunch.com and cook on the Donate button to help support the show in addition of sustaining and improving the podcast for donations will help establish permaculture goddess Temple every bite ecological employment for single mothers Please Subscribe and share your favorite episodes if you have questions or comments feel free to leave a voicemail at 818-275-1593 or email event at Tantra Punk. Com Thomas Day