Positive Sexuality Research, Education, and Outreach with Emily Prior MA TPP107


Emily Prior picIn this episode I’m am joined by the highly accomplished sexuality educator Emily Prior. MA. We discuss a wide array of topics within and beyond the sex positive movement and field of study. She provides insightful guidance and direction on independent research and best practices for aspiring positive sexuality educators.

About Emily E. Prior, MA:

Executive Director/Founder/Co-Editor-in-Chief Journal of Positive Sexuality

Emily E. Prior is the Executive Director for the Center for Positive Sexuality. Since 1996 she has been teaching formal and informal classes about a variety of sexuality-related topics including BDSM lifestyle, Polyamory lifestyle, Gender, Introductory and Advanced Human Sexuality Courses for Psychology and Sociology departments at universities, Teen Sexuality topics for Planned Parenthood Los Angeles and others. Emily has studied human sexuality and gender topics from a variety of perspectives, including Psychology, Sociology, and Anthropology and won the Vern Bullough Award for research. She is a member of The Society for the Scientific Study of Sexuality, American Sociological Association, Pacific Sociological Association , Community-Academic Consortium for Research of Alternative Sexualities (of which she is on the Research Advisory Committee), Los Angeles Sexologists Associates, and Phi Kappa Phi. To contact Emily, please email emily@positivesexuality.org


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Tantra Punk your guide to sexual Liberation healing and empowerment as a certified Tantra counselor and certified permaculture designer I’m here to help you grow spiritually sexually and ecologically my online and in-person counseling sessions and training programs are price to fit any budget I’m looking forward to helping you design and ever more Divine Life Path please send me an email to Ben at Tantra Punk. Com and our journey together will begin pillow their beloveds welcome to Township Punk podcast number 107 I’m on Skype with Emily prior she is the executive director of the center for positive sexuality and la and I am very interested in the people who were working and organizations to further sexuality education and holistic sexual health and just all of the important dimensions of growth and development and progress Progressive sexuality if you will and so I’m excited to hear from you Emily what led you and your life path to play the roles that you do now and if you could definitely tell us about the center and the work that you do there and what it’s all about that be a blessing i I guess starts quite a while ago I decided to go back to school and finish my undergraduate degree and then move on to a graduate degree and somewhere in there I decided that human sexuality was definitely the thing that I wanted to study and that this was sort of where I fit and that this worked for me and there are lots of other things that led up to that of course but as far as the development of the centers concerned that really started then as I was working towards my own education and realizing just how much information was not out there and how much misinformation was out there about a variety of sexual identities and just seeing a huge gaps especially among professionals like medical professionals and therapists and things who I felt should know better and should have this information and knowledge and they just didn’t so that’s really I think what drove me is recognizing that people needed much more information than they were being given do you have just have the top of your head some of the material that you felt most moved to want to educate people and enlightening about topic of Interest was on BDSM so really wanting to explore not only the topic but recognizing that at least from my interactions in the people that I knew and seen in Los Angeles recognizing that this was not something that was psychological this is not a psych disorder this was not but you know a medical condition this wasn’t something that was negative for people but that somehow this perpetuation of it being negative was continuing and continuing continuing and that really needed to change it was really painful to see friends and family members go to therapist and go to Physicians and just not be taken seriously or not be heard and so that was really my first Passion was trying to change how people felt about BDSM and how people thought about it that dovetailed into also talking about polyamory successful non-monogamy and that dovetail dindu sort of the breaking down the myths and misconceptions around sex work and it just continues to snowball. Seems like it said there’s these gateways for sure and so how what would you say you’re so helpful changes that have occurred thanks to your efforts and efforts of the center and just two people at large kind of hacking away at these old myths and legends about sexuality they don’t service I’ve seen huge differences so easily almost 20 years ago when I started down this path of sort of informal education and then we’re formalizing that around these topics at that time when you told a group of college students look people who do this aren’t bad or weird or whatever this is just who they are and and at that time there was a lot of pushback there was a lot more people who like no no no they must have all been abused or they must have had some traumatic event occur or it must be something wrong with that it can’t be normal and now 18 20 years later now most of my students are saying yeah got that how do I do it so there’s been a huge shift over those two decades in just people’s perceptions well it’s so how do you what what is catalyzed at do you think or what are some of the key factors that just more of the internet obviously people having access to discover like my folks that want to play and do you know consensual a huge part of that and I think most of it’s been for the better obviously the internet has its downfalls as well but I think it’s really really help to bring all of these things to lighten to help people find connections with people and I mean in Los Angeles it’s a little easier to find like-minded folks no matter how out there you are but when you’re in the middle of the country somewhere in that might be your only Lifeline it might be your only way to reach people who could be hundreds or thousands of miles away from you that that may connect with you know that part of yourself so I think that that’s made a huge difference I think another part of it has been in the past 10 years easily the academic research on these topics has really shifted considerably and I think that’s now starting to filter into the general public where academics are reaching Physicians and therapists and and other professionals at 11 that I think is now starting to affect their interactions with the everyday person and I think media media has done a big shift and I mean you know they’re still so sensationalism and there are still some objectification and exploitation I think in some forms of media but generally media is treating these topics a little bit less salaciously a little bit more positively cool and you are talked about the the history and development a bit of the center and what time you guys were you all provide there and years ago so we’re celebrating our 10-year anniversary this year and that’s really fantastic we’ve been an official 501 c 3 nonprofit since 2013 so that were coming up on getting closer to 5 years of that but we’ve always worked as a non-profit it’s just that’s as long as we’ve been official and really our goals are to provide Education and Research on sexual and gender diversity is brought an army ants as possible the history of that came from myself and a few other local community members in Los Angeles who were doing some presentations through another organization out at colleges universities in the area it was only on BDSM and I was sort of the coordinator for these at the time and recognized that the group of us that we’re doing this didn’t seem to be inclusive enough of the larger SM communities in Los Angeles cuz there’s a whole lot going on here and we’re in a great City and that the local communities really talk to each other and communicate things to each other and this really isn’t happening in any other city so hear the gay leather community and the federal community in the pansexual community and and the high protocol Master Slave community and all of these other things really coordinate with each other or at least aware of each other and talk to each other in La that doesn’t that’s not happening in any other city that I’m aware of and so I wanted a better representation of people so we ended up can I bring in people from other organizations and being a part of that and then because of the questions we were being asked by students every conversation and then we start talking about BDSM but we realized that now that they had people in front of them who were willing to talk openly about sex they had questions about everything and I realize that we really needed to be able to talk about a lot more topics than just us M so we branched off and created the center and started to expand the topics that we were talking about so our education programs have been going on for 10 years now and we’ve gone from presenting to maybe two or three colleges at a time like in a semester maybe a couple of hundred students here they are now we’re speaking too easily more than a dozen colleges every semester and more than a my students every semester but that’s really expanded quite a lot well I so what are ya what are some of the titles of the talks or the workshops that you’re giving off talk about polyamory and consensual non-monogamy we talk about sex workers we talked about sex and disabilities who talked about sex and aging now we’re starting to put some new programs together doing a complete lecture presentation on the dimensions of positive sexuality putting one together on a paper that some of us have co-authored on the four C’s talking about consent in communication and caring and caution as the means of interacting and relationships so yeah we have a lot of different topics cool saying that in that span of time you you probably been in a good position to kind of survey but maybe even very formally but at least informally survey shifts in attitudes and obviously this opening up of more curiosity and interest in it’s more of an open-ended conversation now for sure and are you seeing this is something I’ve noticed I’m curious you probably have better either either or both anecdotal or you know real good statistical data on younger people kind of coming out of the box so to speak way more gender-fluid and polyamorous just by Nature almost feels like there’s some force of nature phenomenon that’s kind of bucking the old paradigms without a lot of really focused deconditioning or or even really highly Advanced you know informational training programs are just kind of getting it there just kind of more free and open and and generous sexually is that is that accurate it needs to be researched but I definitely feel like the younger Generations are so much more open and Ender really looking at these topics and saying you know why are we even talking about this don’t we just get it this is just who we are like we’re fluid in our gender more fluid in her sexuality more fluid in a relationship gone and I don’t know if that more knowledge I don’t know if that’s more a better sense of security I don’t know if that’s a push against you know structure and and parents and Society you know of that rebellion and I think she were now seeing a very clear seconds and maybe 3rd generation of open kinky poly fluid people who grew up with parents who were the openly that way and it’s just it like they’re going out this is not a thing this is just how I grew up seeing more of that too that’s so cool cuz I feel like I’ve had this the saying this is what it looks like when it when a religion dies you know if it if it were another thing I’ve ever actually country singer who was going to call and say that if if you don’t if if a culture stops walking a path in the forest that say they’re Village your culture they stop walking a path in the forest within a generation to pass disappears forever heck of a good or bad if the path was shaming people about their sexual diversity so it’s refreshing to see even on dating websites I feel like I’m witnessing there’s is Pyramid of the older the brackets of decades and age you get the more clamp down and close. You could say it’s old-fashioned to be monogamous people are defining it in so many different ways and I really try to stress to people you don’t like you can be monogamous but make sure that you were definition of that matches your partners definition cuz a lot of people see that in a lot of different ways so are you are there resources or Workshop specifically around how to deal with them some of the challenges of opening up relationships or if coming out kinky or I guess that’s that’s a lot of what you do what you do is kind of provide people resources for exploration and it’s safe here are some of the local things around Los Angeles and it is just a handful of the meaning of the bazillion things and hear some books you might want to read hear some academic resources you might want to reference who hears would have been a ray of a resource material for you and we also on our website we have sexuality Resource page. Just has tons and tons and tons of links you all sorts of things on son of some of them are sex positive therapists or counselors or physician some of them are other resource things were educational materials or websites or you know just all kinds of things cool so how about it are you getting a lot of interest from sexuality Educators either in the school the standard curriculum school system or maybe Charter Schools or private schools are homeschooling parents or is there any feedback and program development on that sort of dimension of Education time we’ve not really breached into dealing with people who are under 18 so we’ve specifically hit college students because then we don’t need parental permission we haven’t yet breached the the under age group especially because of the topics that were we’ve been covering and although it is obviously people at 14 15 16 know that they’re kinky your know that they’re not monogamous they know these things and have an inkling of what they’re interested in or what they want to pursue but I think that’s a really difficult topic to get parents and teachers behind to get the school system behind I’m hoping that since California has recently added the lgbtq studies portion to their overall curriculum for Public School Systems I’m hoping that that will allow us to Branch into that Arena at some point as they need to start incorporating the history of gays and lesbians and queer people into everyday schooling and hopefully on the tale of that can come talking about some of these other topics as well that’s cool yeah I remember I mean I said I was as a youth in the feels a little more than just queer or the list of acronyms but as a Teenage cuerdo I remember you know using or accessing you know homeless youth resources when I was on the street and and there was a kind of bypassed the whole standard anything as pretty much an alternative reality but there was an Ambience of sexual freedom and autonomy in a lot if you know sex work was happening and there were a lot of the staff for the drop-in centers would be College they be doing internships and what not Inn in now that I’m now that I’m getting more that I’m getting older and I’m realizing how they must have been really a pioneering or maybe taking a lot of rain Steven have any kind of conversation of any sexual contact whatsoever and I don’t know what kind of training they were getting to protect them from I mean do you have any reference material for that four four what is what are the boundaries that adult Professionals in sexuality education field or supposed to maintain if they ever I don’t even know who I’m getting emails from, but I don’t I don’t want to respond to an email with a link to an instructional video that’s pornographic you know what I mean without age verifying that I’m talking to an adult I mean I don’t know whose you know what lawyers are making best practices info sheets for stuff like that so I’m curious but maybe you would have some some inside around. chat with Planned Parenthood and I and I was a sex educator with Planned Parenthood for several years and we went into high schools public high schools throughout Los Angeles to do basic training and because I was working with Planned Parenthood because I was a sex educator and now because I’m a professor and teach sexuality courses at the college and university level like I’m a required reporter so so abused to me report something like that I am required to make a special report of that so I try to tell students ahead of time look I’m required by law to make these reports so don’t tell me things that you don’t want reported you know if there’s a case of sexual harassment a sexual assault or anything like that I’m a required reporter and so many people who are trained in those sorts of facilities are at least at that level legally responsible and I’m not sure exactly what the other sort of legal standards might be around those I think it would depend on a specific job so I know that there are some things like if you’re a counselor or therapist you may have certain obligations legally either to protect the people that you interact with daily your clients or again you might be legally required to report certain things to the authorities but beyond that I don’t really know okay yeah it’s definitely something to I’ll be maybe I will get together some resources on that and I’ll share it with you if I can eventually have some kind of you know once you done that so cuz now with the social media internet and I just don’t there’s so many laws that are unenforceable given the landscape of social media and that’s a huge kind of can of worms and so I certainly want to be on the up-and-up and Advising people to do the same so I mean there’s a whole thing about the miners are sending nude photos back and forth to each other during their sexting than there’s a hole you know major concern with that if you were a school teacher and you have and you intervene in some you think they’re passing notes that used to be just hey are you passing notes but if you grab that phone and you see something you know all hell could break loose for everybody so teaching people who were under the age of 18 and they’re passing these photos while that’s considered child pronography distribution of child pronography and some schools are handling that very very strict late so some schools are actually prosecuting attorney at least you know at least kind of telling on those students and letting the District Attorney’s deal with it it’s kind of you know I mean I tell my students we didn’t have these things when I was a teenager but that’s not doesn’t mean we didn’t send dirty pictures to each other material back and forth we had Polaroid’s and we could draw and like it doesn’t mean it didn’t happen but I don’t think it was handled in quite the same way and it certainly not as quick and easy as it is now certainly not with the best camera quality but I’m not sure I’m not sure that we should be handling it and quite the strict manner that we are all the time I think it needs to be a case-by-case basis where is certainly different if you know if they have some form of if it’s consensual rated mean if the event that would be the basis to determine whether or not somebody was spamming someone with nude pictures of the form of sexual harassment and that can be proven that there the intent was there and did their page so now we have to fill out some kind of release form that the school provides a child to receive dirty pictures from another child is of age cuz that isn’t that part of the California’s within three years this is important because people don’t know what they don’t know about how they could be viable all the time for all kinds of things that they don’t even think about stuff tell my Steven my college-age students like you want to be very very careful about this because it’s within it’s the state of California guidelines as it’s within 3 years if you are 17 and under but that don’t that starts at like 12 so you know like between an 8 year old and 11 year old or 12 year old not specs not going to hold like that’s not going to be acceptable it has to start with the age of 12 and going up you can’t backtrack it’s so if the person younger than 12 it’s still really really illegal and and not going to work in your favor but 12r kind of looking okay so if you’re 12 in the person you’re interested in a little bit older than maybe but you need to be careful with that and I think the big problem comes in is when we have people around the cusp so you have somebody’s 15 16 17 to date someone and they they turn 18 you know the other partner turns 18 and now what so now you’re not supposed to be in this relationship any longer and now all of a sudden you cannot consent to this relationship I don’t know I feel like there’s a I understand the laws and I understand the reasons for it I think it’s great to protect people but I also think we don’t give teens credit for being actual sexual persons who could make choices for themselves yeah I was certainly with a lot of older women when I was under 18 so that would have I would have been upset and sad if anyone tried to step in and on that but it’s gendered announcer complicated certainly you I don’t know I guess in my area would have been that just as a rule of thumb male sexual energy was just kind of demonised is being Territorial. And now it’s like a lesbian couple it’s a female identified female body young women who were yeah it’s a different just tell me a different Dynamic so who knows where it’ll lead at this point but at least the center for positive sexuality is here to have these conversations and do you have do you have do you want to talk about a bit about what your your passion is as an educator in the professor like what are you do you have any research that you’re doing your Department’s or you kind of thumb yeah like kind of locking into a specific topics that interest you amongst all these things I mean most of my work still centers around sexuality and I usually teach introductory an advanced human sexuality courses I also teach other classes so I teach mainly in sociology departments so you know I teach about society and culture and people but I really like teaching about deviance and we research on deviance and identity and and all that kind of stuff so a lot of my research is about BDSM is about sex work is about feminist pornography is a kinds of fun stuff I’m presenting at a conference next month on a paper that came out about a year ago and the Journal of sex medicine my colleagues and I did a study on looking at BDSM as a Leisure activity so if we can say fine it’s not pathology let’s stop talking about it that way so okay then what is it and we thought well maybe it’s fits Leisure and if we look at leisure as not just a Pastime but as something that you identify with something that makes you feel whole makes you feel fulfilled is something that you choose to do then then I think it can fit into that category so that’s one of the big one of the big research projects I worked on very recently that’s awesome you have to make it makes me think that if I were to have to explain anthropologically or take that sort of the view of being an alien trying to understand what people are doing her I would kind of say well when when kids are pre-pubescent they make believe and they create epic worlds of Adventure and fantasy role-play and then when people come of age you become adults and they realize that they have these new toys that develop then they want to use them and actually be imaginative and creative in and use their whole potential of their erogenous imagination and their new toys and then they can actually play freely with each other where you know when when kids are playing playing games that you would consider to be somewhat violent and nature they don’t usually actually harm or kill each other you know so it’s not that hard it’s not that great of a leap of logic right to imagine that adults would reaxis some of that imaginary fun making instincts or hate American culture as we really look down on Leisure we would look down on play and we look down on make-believe and so we decide that’s just for children and it’s not for grown ups and I think that that’s a really horrible horrible perspectives of the world cuz you’re only a child for a very very brief point of your life and you’re an adult for a really really long part of your life and wouldn’t I don’t want to stop playing. Why would you want to grow up ever and so yeah I think of BDSM I think erotic play I feel like yeah it’s just this extension of your creativity and artistic and Tristan and your means of expressing yourself and now you get to have sex so why wouldn’t you add that and everything else thank you for helping to frame it that way cuz that it’s it’s so it’s easier to digest when you when I just have never heard that what that phrase before but it just erotic play being obviously it means that you could incorporate more than just your one monogamous married partner that’s just still only allowed that culturally they by the mainstream the idea of being sexually playful with a group of people in the community of people as a social activity like a cocktail party or a mixer or I mean why can’t you believe make break into play make-believe you know the okay fine I just I’m this is my partner this is the only person I’m going to have sex with her I’m going to be in love with or however you’re defining that but I can pretend for the next hour or two that there’s someone I’ve never met before or that there a superhero or that a magical being or whatever and that can really shift your erotic interest in your erotic pleasure I think you probably would be able to say that it will make a lot of relationships last longer and be more Pap more healthier happier for sustainable resilient cuz you’re not getting bored and giving up and going you know stoic that’s great so do you have a key tell it tell me more about the center and how it how it runs and functions is it kind of like a drop-in center or do you have only certain events at certain times or how does the facility time work out we don’t actually have a physical location most of it exists inside my laptop and out of and that means we don’t have to pay for rent so that’s why we go to where we need to go so you know we have regular meetings happen in my house or one of the other board members houses we do have some events here and there are a lot of our fundraisers or just online to make it easier to reach as many people as possible and of course we’re trying to reach a broader audience than just Los Angeles so we Skype workshops we Skype things we’ve talked to classes in New York and classes in Idaho and you know all over the place so you know we do a lot of different things we also have an academic Journal that you’re positive sexuality it’s free it’s open access anyone is welcome to use it and read it and submit work to it and you know that’s been going we’re now in our third year of publication of that and that is hitting a worldwide audience some of the countries that are accessing this are it’s all over in Australia and in Belgium and in various parts of the UK and it’s hitting parts of Asia Japan so it’s really really great so we have a very wide reach and what we do we have approximately 50 to 60 volunteers who work with us we also have an internship program so we get college students who want internship credits or what the work experience and so they volunteer for a specific. Of time and work on specific projects for us at different times of the year we get most of our interns during the summer but we get interns year-round and we have in our volunteers so we have Educators we have people who are research Affiliates and who published research and use the center is one of their professional affiliations we have research assistants who helped them we do you work with events so we do some Outreach events I think on Wednesday we’re going to UCLA sextravaganza which is been happening for several years on UCLA’s campus that we usually set up a booth are we do that with other things around town we’ve also have members some of our volunteers go to conferences all over the world and represent us at different places and in different areas where they were very popular in Melbourne just found out from a friend who’s been living in Australia for past couple years so I can’t I guess we’ll have to go there at some point cool it’s a new cloud-based model it’s elegant and overhead in the neighborhood drama and that there’s a lot of reasons to transcend that six location and you can if you can be a mobile you know unit then you can just take your your your laptop and projector and some you know what your handouts or whatever you have in this b a and again because true using Skype and using other types of internet programs you know we can get into a classroom you know that might not be able to bring us there physically but we can still do it will set it up on our end and and just stream live stream wherever we need to be and and it’s very helpful to cuz we so we have volunteers I think are farthest away volunteer that we’ve had so far was in Trinidad so we can have volunteers from anywhere in the world who can work with us medication programs and so they help us Creator update or education resources in our reference materials and putting together things to help teachers facilitate this in their classes they might actually be one of our Educators we train people to go out to those classes and to give presentations to places we have research assistants to make come in with a certain amount of background knowledge and how to do academic research and some come in just wanted to learn it and so we trained them and they work with people who are doing research in various aspects of positive sexuality and so some of them get to co-author papers and some of them get to work on the ground floor of research happening and get to really get into what that is and have a voice and have an influence in what’s being done in the academic world and this is course then starts to affect policy when we’re putting scientific research in front of people and saying here this is what the says that’s not the correct or let them besides these aspects and that can be very very helpful we work with other organizations so and CSF the National Coalition for sexual freedom is one of our sort of co-working his nation’s the community academic Consortium for research on alternative sexualities we work with them as well yeah I’m getting chills yeah I’m getting chills cuz this is a lot more than I bargained for and actually seeking a lot of what you’re describing and to have yeah we hope we have a good bit of time last time feeling compelled to ask you a little bit about I guess hey if you’re into taboos right blowing them there is all I ever believed starting this week there’s going to be the biggest psychedelic science conference in the history of humanity happening in the Bay Area it’s put together by that multidisciplinary Association for psychedelic studies and the there’s a lot of really important cutting-edge legal for the first time in decades studies happening all over the world with psilocybin you know I gave magic mushrooms and MDMA and Ayahuasca and marijuana and peyote and I will gain a number of other synthetic and natural organic you could say psychedelic compounds in a lot of it is at this point in this stage of the Renaissance of research it’s really about proving the safety the relative safety of different compounds getting the dosage to be sort of understood better at also having some really important clinical trials around ending ending addiction to harmful drugs ending cigarette addiction end-of-life anxiety sexual abuse and Trauma and PTSD from War veterans there’s all these different the demographics that are starting to have really groundbreaking results and they’re doing you know they’re putting in the millions of dollars to do the the research for all this and so I bring that up just to say that this is an interesting juncture for me because the a cultural cliche about sex drugs and rock and roll and you know the way that the culture of inebrians is starting to move a large part due to Raves and festivals it’s moving more towards entheogens than just Coke and heroin and meth and booze there’s more opportunities for people who are coming into their sexuality to have access to psychedelic experiences and so there’s the new Alchemy of innocent in these Generations between sex drugs and rock and roll and if it’s it’s it’s it’s a lot more sophisticated and advanced and and and just more diverse in many ways than it was in the 60s when it was you know Acid Rock and LSD and other birth of the the hippie movement in the 60s but I’m wondering if you have in your position they’re come across any any any people who are interested in in rigorous academic study of what this new sex and drugs and rock and roll Paradigm it is shaping up to become if there’s anyone interested in that that you know of he’s been there are definitely people who are starting who are doing research on these topics and very often the connection that ends up happening in the academic research is you know if we’re looking at the sex drugs and rock and roll that of course is going to look at the outcomes and too often I think the the outcome that gets stressed is okay so what’s the what’s the public health issue so is it possible or is it likely that people are might be transmitting STIs because they might be under the influence of something or maybe they can’t we do we have to worry about consent if someone is under the influence of something that then means that they cannot now consent to what happens at that point so what happens if everybody who’s involved have done that so where does that line get drawn so I think a lot of the issues that have come up in recent research has been either on public health topics around STI transmission or on consent topics recognizing that at least by law if someone is inebriated for example they can now no longer consent to sexual activity okay so what happens if everybody involved. That’s so interesting yet that’s exactly what I’ve been actually encountering and in just by life experiences it’s there’s there’s a lot of people now who were you can say you were having expanded Consciousness through empty agentic use meaning it’s kind of a nice way of saying psychedelic no drugs but but that’s an important consideration because just because you feel like you’re enlightened than that one with God doesn’t mean that you’re immune from being the perpetrator with that Enlightenment that you don’t think you have a potential for abuse and even if it’s not that sort of shady you know where that sort of Insidious there’s also just the issue you’re not in your body if you’re having an out-of-body ecstatic psychedelic experience how how do you get even if you can send it to the idea of something earlier in the evening that has to be held through somehow and if you lose the if you become somebody else or part of your higher self or whatever it could be theirs that’s some chicky territory for sure yeah so that’s I guess there’s you know that I’ve seen like at electronic dance music events you can call him Rave but that’s kind of more you know probably more accurate term these days cuz there’s within that whole world there’s different camps and it’s more no more more bride to just called electronic dance music these days but you know there is there’s sort of harm reduction education Outreach groups that put out one sheet kind of look like glass CD mailer cards you know about business matters and they have kind of a profile of what the different substances how did how to test and make sure that they’re real or are what you’re getting it like that there’s that whole harm reduction education Outreach approach that is kind of like what you’re talking about but it’s for the party scene in just for best and better practices around that but I could see that they’re being a sum interest group of people where they would want to see things the way you’re talking about it cuz I actually no way you’re framing it it it feels like there’s a lot more due diligence for people that want to be credible and respectable and using best practices to actually think with some of these analytical tools so I’m hoping you’ll be great if there was some overlap or or or Synergy with all this stuff I think more and more what is happening as we’re seeing the people who are actually involved in all of these different spaces you know the people were actually doing whatever it is we’re talking about having more influence on the research that’s being conducted so that it creates a more authentic overall experience and I think it adds a level of legitimacy to the research so rather than a researcher sort of from on high saying well I’m going to study this group and I think what they’re doing may not be safe and so we know the perspective that I’m going to come about with this is that well this is already inherently unsafe and now I’m going to show you why it’s in safe and I think more and more we have researchers who are in these communities who are in these faces or doing all of these things and you say you know maybe we need to do is talk to the people who were actually doing this and not talk to them with a preconceived notion of what’s going on or what they’re experiencing or what may be happening but go in just as a hey could give us some information to tell us about what’s happening and I think we’re seeing more of that so there has been research on for example like barebacking and there’s been research on sex workers experiences and there’s been research on sort of the the spiritual some of the spiritual Connections in the spiritual extremes that can be experienced through extreme SM activities light hookah coals and those kinds of things so we’re seeing more and more of that happening where people who are actually in these groups are part of the subcultures are also crossovers into the academic life and we’re just seeing an amazing amount of research that starting to Bubble to the surface and get a little bit of space. I think this research has been getting done for quite a while but it can be really hard to get it published because some of the academic Publishers don’t want to hear about it and I want you to my is any of these things so if they publish something on it they want to be really careful so with our journal and with some of the other journals out there we’ve been able to bridge. Cap and actually be able to show some I feel like more authentic stories well absolutely will now in this world have so many The Gatekeepers being dissolved by the power of the internet I feel like you know there’s a lot of bad journalism or untrained journalism so there’s got to be a lot of bad or untrained or Incredible or uncredible research but maybe it’s the methodology that can be what’s the word sort of feel like I could imagine what as you were speaking I was imagining will wouldn’t it be great to train the you know that like the anthropological participation observation ethnography kind of model but if you were to train if you were coming from that subculture and you wanted to sort of document your tribe and produce your own ethnography kind of amongst your friends kind of tabulate experiences and collect notes insured compare notes is there was you recommend any kind of Crash Course doing data collection for different types of research paper I’m doing ethnography in the field and sort of how that works and how you can sort of pull everything together there’s a really good little guidebooks you know a quick online search for for some of these guys are out there and ask her if she is amazing stuff I love doing a photography by the way I think it’s an incredible tool that doesn’t get use nearly enough and and it got a lot of researchers a colleague of mine she recently did a photographic ethnographic working with lgbtq Foster Youth and homeless Youth and kind of went out gave them all cameras and said take photographs of Your World of your life of who you are, and they did a whole art show you know like found a gallery in Downtown LA and just played everyone’s photographs and and you know really got people connected to them and seeing them as people who have life experiences and they’re not just sort of a category of disadvantaged kids so yeah I think there’s there’s an easy guide books out there just like a quick you can find some quick little things of how to do ethnography and how to do that and but I think a lot of that to starts with her own storytelling so things that you do and things that others do and and all the bloggers out there and everything of these are all forms of ethnography relay yeah that’s cool it’s just that it’s exciting and hopeful cuz I feel that I’m at a point where I’m doing kind of pseudo-scientific Rogue radical research that’s way too far out for any government agency or any academic institution to touch with a ten-foot pole so it’s it’s kind of on me and my colleagues and friends 2 do this sort of underground research but then hope that it it’s done in a way that it can be respectable or it can be legitimated later you know but it is probably good to do what you’re suggesting and actually have some some templates for collecting the data that mean okay here’s what would our experiment yielded and here’s the methodology in the procedure and you can test it on your own Hardy or lab or whatever replicate what you’ve done and so can you give enough information that would allow somebody else to replicate and get similar results in their own place or find totally different results which is also fascinating injured and interesting and yeah and I think that’s really I mean that’s science that is science Sciences pushing boundaries and science is you now let’s try a new thing and see what happens and science is telling a new story or New Perspective of a story and you know I think that that’s been lost over the past many years Society The Sciences inquiry science is asking questions and wondering why thing happens and how something happens and trying to figure that out and I think that we’ve sort of collectively as a larger society have sort of lost that Focus write the word crowdsourced crowd-source funding crowdsourced ideas and editing and an art I mean you were talking about that at that photo gallery exhibit and that’s a great example if you would call that a crowd-sourced ethnographic oh yeah photojournalism nice oh yeah that’s cool that’s that’s exciting time so I’m also wondering now do you have do you do you or your organization the Center provide any kind of consulting services or any kind of where you could be hired or you could be sort of commissioned to do research or to consult on Research I don’t know that we’re I don’t know that anybody is really hired to do research cuz wouldn’t it be fantastic if someone will pay for that but that doesn’t happen if we do get hired as consultants for a variety of things so either individuals within the organization or the collective organization May consult on certain projects or consult on like creative curriculum for a particular thing and we have individuals who are consulted on court cases and I’m legal issues so so there’s a lot of that we also get hired by professionals like to teach professional workshops on various topics so that happens as well because we’re a nonprofit although those things are often we you know ask for fee cuz usually the people who were asking for these services are people who can pay for it but what going out to the schools we’re going to colleges in touch or we have a student group asked us to come and do something with them or like what you know we go to somebody’s community of answer something we may ask for an honorarium but we’re going to do this stuff for free so we really depend on our donors and our contributors and the people who support us to kind of give us the funding that we need in order to do what we want to do and and to publishing and all the other stuff so our journals available for free most of our Outreach staff and education program is all for free so yeah a lot of what we do depends on donations as opposed to people actually hiring us officially to do something right on that sounds like a healthy well-rounded multi Revenue stream nonprofit you’re definitely fulfilling your mission in so many beautiful dimensions and I’m just really happy to know that we’ve connected to some really feel better about living in the world with you more offline 2 just to explore some of these Consulting opportunities that you have and see what we’re about and all of that stuff were completely volunteer so none of us are paid for what we do I don’t run a paycheck nobody wants a paycheck that’s completely volunteer and yeah we’re just we’re just trying to let you know we just try to bring it enough funds to keep going and to keep doing what we’re doing and to expand so we’re actually going to be expanding our face-to-face education program out to Chicago over the next few months so Craig can you do that that’s well thank you so much that’s great I feel like it’s it’s really refreshing to to hear that there are people out there who are so dedicated to the cause that it’s that you did not just going to slam the door in your face if you don’t write a check if you know the first five minutes if you’re not going to bill me for this podcast interview right now about an hour into it is do you have a sort of committee or task force or team or just even a person who is either because they are a trauma Survivor or because it’s just near and dear to their hearts whatever reason is there you do consent workshops in self-defense or rape and assault prevention and any any more of the or any any of the sort of preventative and treatment kind of education unpreparedness we do have programs around consent we don’t really specifically talk about self defense or or right prevention in the standard sense so we don’t really talk about here’s what you can do to prevent being raped we talked about here’s what you can do to not rape someone because really this is not on the victim this is on the perpetrator but we also talked about you know here’s other ways that you might think about your sexual self and your identity in the power dynamics that you may interact with and find consensual outlets for some of your interests and behaviors and the citiz and you know we talked about a wide range of those things so it would be great if the people who are doing the Rape Crisis counseling and who are just in the trenches of dealing with battered women and in and going in and and doing you know investigations to catch meant to prosecute the perpetrators of all ages if they were I would let it would be great if in it you know in a perfect world they were seeking you all to educate themselves on better prevention and better version or diversion from the criminal whole that the response like they’re coming as the First Responders two incidents that would have been prevented by a proper education on all sides right and we do have we do have information so some of our researchers and and because we have people who are social workers who have conducted research through us who have published on how to do how to have a sex positive approach to handling victims how to have a sex positive approach to handling offenders and that these approaches can really help reduce crime can reduce negative stigma can reduce it comes cool is that would that be on your website or at some if I if I can follow up with you later cool okay well alright I feel like it’s this is yes. A real blessing and I just want to thank you again for your time and generous sharing of great info so with that said do you want to give the website and any other maybe upcoming events or anything else you’d like to promote and the website is positive sexuality. Org journal and that’s Journal of positive sexuality. Org we have our anniversary party coming up this July so if you want to be invited and want to be a part of that anniversary party will be a fundraiser you can contact me at Emily Emily at positive sexuality. Org or you can go to our website and put in your email address and then you’re on our newsletter list and you’ll get information through our newsletter about our party and we’re hoping we’re putting together an academic conference for next year so look on our website check things out if you go to sex pause khan.com so s e x p o s c o n. Com there’s going to be updated information they’re probably starting in the next couple of weeks for our positive sexuality conference coming up in 2018 in Burbank all right that’s very exciting thank you again yeah that’s me alright thank you so much again and I will hopefully I’ll be in touch soon thank you for listening to the touch of Time Podcast please go to www.crunch.com and cook on the Donate button to help support the show in addition of sustaining and improving the podcast for donations will help establish permaculture goddess Temple every bite ecological employment for single mothers Please Subscribe and share your favorite sex if you have questions or comments feel free to leave a voicemail at 818-275-1593 or email been at kontrapunkt. Com Thomas gay