Carol Jenny Holding a Pranic Healing Crystal with Clouds in the Background

Demons Disguised as Dakas with Carol Jenny TPP25

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The wonderful and amazing Carol Jenny is back to share more adventures in Pranic Healing. We talk about the difference between elementals and entities, how they look, behave and transfer. We emphasize the dangers of Tantra Pujas with unvetted predatory attendees, unconscious practitioners, and unethical instructors who are spreading demons and contaminating others.

You can contact her for in-person and distance healing at:

singingwhales {at} aol {dot} com
http://www.caroljennyhealer.com

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Tantra Punk your guide to sexual Liberation healing and empowerment as a certified Tantra counselor and certified permaculture designer I’m here to help you grow spiritually sexually and ecologically my online and in-person counseling sessions and training programs are price to fit any budget I’m looking forward to helping you design and ever more Divine Life Path please send me an email to Ben at Tantra Punk. Com and our journey together will begin welcome back Carol Jenny this is Tasha Punk podcast episode number 25 and I’m thrilled to have you give us some updates about your adventures and pranic healing and you talked about Elemental energies last time in the chakras switch add two addictive Cycles can you recap a little bit of that yeah the Elementals are actually Spirit form just like if you’ve ever heard of plant Journeys what is giving it experience is the spirits of the plan it translates into your average of an elemental Elemental addiction has its own form that you can actually see I’m not a clear point in that way yet I don’t know if I want to feel that either. pranic healing with metric or actually Sam tell him was based off and then he developed his whole system based on East Indian pranic healing and also the East Asian and education process of developing healers and kind of a tree that you are researching during all this like basically metaphysical psychic research proven by science approach addictions are really maintained in the body because of his Elemental because or whatever you’re angry but you have to press belly area when your liver is and still deliver as an organ stores anger and so what you want to do this you want to know the pain of that for that kind of anger is alcohol so when you start using alcohol then what happens is you now have the Elementals in the alcohol that are now in your body and in your light body your chakras and what not shelves want you to keep taking the alcohol disengage from the craving that’s why recovery is so hard and that’s why people going to rehab so if you really really want to get out of the cycle of the Elementals as long as they’re in your body and a subject so this is the hardest thing to quit Beyond open so the Elementals are in there and they just want you to go do that I heard one and tell me she said she’s trying to Stage to smoke to clear their heart chakra when they’re smoking I never thought about it but it made sense to me because you know the Native Americans and interesting perspective but then you have yeah and so so if you want to if you want to disengage from that diction I think it’s really imperative to have energy healing to remove the Elementals if you really really do want to heal from the direction I think you got to do that otherwise it’s just going to be this I hope we can do things cycling in and out no so that’s another element to cure and healing yourself that I think people should know about yeah you can you can pull them out you can check them out it’s not a problem if you get a pranic Healer in specifically they will know how to do this if it’s not it’s not. Magic or rocket science don’t know how to do this so it may take a while I know when I was coming up from when I was really ill it took me awhile to come into the vibration and learn to and change it and maintain that that’s a whole different thing I think addiction A Healer that I engage myself she said I think if I remember correctly she said three months no less than three months I think it was like you know that she said she had had success with people that were addicted to cigarettes and things like that but it’s an amazingly short. Of time considering and yeah I just want to educate and let people know what is proven to really work so there you go to different than the Elementals out forms and it kind of freaked me out but at least I had the knowledge base and the resources at my fingertips to deal with it okay one and knowledge of somebody else that had a miter entities and then a direct express myself from somebody transmitting them to me so the first one is just a little friend of mine and it prevents him from loving in a fuller way to watch Major curses from other people and then I had to like decontaminate myself the first time for 6 hours and the other one I had actually hire a shaman to like help me and so you know harm you even though you’re doing protective techniques so different skill sets and come from different tradition then I know what to do and what not to do even though I’m trained on some level some of these you know so I’m very careful and they come with us in this Incarnation and so I had a big anaconda snakes in these leaks like like things in people’s third eye I asked you to help them and they plead you know why I can’t get out of there some people that do Shadow work and that’s their expertise can I give you their car yeah you could do it nothing cuz I don’t do that but here’s what happened to me what happened to me is at my doorstep this is a person I was kind of sent to go find has made her age major been abused his childhood and I wish I had to go find him and it was my doctor’s a company she works for it so organic company of vitamins and supplements training as her guess so I didn’t need to go again but I was like being pushed friend week 8 became friends over the phone and there’s our great right and so then I’m here right okay you’re here at my doorstep and so he comes in and he’s extremely sometimes during 1400 miles at a stretch without sleeping in some of these bands are full of people who and when you have grade shredded orange filled with holes in it and try to guess who comes in a discarnate being looking for a new host gossip are they can be or they can be demonic would be agreeing if you say you have most of them are going to be smoking cigarettes and drinking for this Lake and then sex addicts and eaglemaniacs send rageaholic Philip is there top of it all right if I tried it when I explain you know where the stuff looks like from what I’ve seen in my journeying you know I’m working on myself and others and what not to doing this my kind of work it’s like I say if you ever been you know the beach and you pick up a rock and you see all these different creatures scattering that’s what it’s there’s a big ones small ones you know they’re eating each other some of them are chasing each other around party in there Salvador Dali do those kind of paintings of people in he’ll remember what it’s called but I’ve been looking at a lot of different depictions a lot of artists have a glimpse into the inner yeah ecology that’s pretty profound in me see that there’s a lot of different analogies to Aquatic Life forms like you said the brine shrimp and stuff you know I see all kinds of the Elementals are sorta like that all kind of stewing around in there screwing around right look like frying shrimp you know cuz if I took all of the critters out it was tomorrow you wouldn’t even know who you were. They create right if you are beaten as a child and your parents rejected you then you’re going to attract that the rest of your life until you become conscious of that all the time it’s actually Trump hugging you more so I can you come conscious realization is I’m the only constant in all my environment it’s attracted to me I am my own point of Attraction so therefore oh yeah I was beating project I have this drama that stuck in my life and it’s really on the the client time they choose how much gets removed how much gets you all day today they’re allowing okay to just go incremental and they do mentally and technically do the job tell me what they control. The difference between the entities and Elementals in the bus the the drug addicts on the the the bus driver in all the beyond belief right running ragged and the destination of the drawers so it’s illegal by the way then you can pay for say when a Taurus plans for early last minute so it’s exactly across the United States instead of being really organized hospital Dover drive to your overall well-being is my metal so he would 3 weeks of driving being a Healer he comes in he sits down and I whip out my crystal cuz I’m your passenger you can stay in my home all the time and they start messing with the machines they was free. Off the bus the bus like wasn’t working. painting is auric field because I have to look at there something I don’t know if I have to do this for you to even stay in my home because you are so covered in this crap but it didn’t like fixes thing that time cuz I didn’t know I just made him cleaned up so I can talk to me and we rested you know and I gave him some chocolate and we were trying to turn me on the chocolate but it was smooth I took a double terminated Quartz in a cup the place I said here I’m just going to give you this technique you know from a shamanic or a metaphysical point of view and when he’s not right now here’s my double tournament terminated quartz crystal and here’s a salt and I want you to start doing the spot I want you to be very nice people and pointed at so they don’t release downtown my loveseat you know meeting over and freaking out over here next to the loveseat stop yes it is not doing it stopped plenty of me hell and it’s pointing at you for a long time right in your auric field Kirkland’s haircut laser cutting double terminated then you’re not just commanding the crystal to do things for that person which one pointed when to do right from both sides so what’s happening is the information that they’re releasing is going to the Crystal and now going in you wish wish the entities made him do that she’s not conscious while he was planning it to me was created by the entity so that he would poison at me and then his rebuttal his his argument with me was them because they wanted to keep creating a chair in my auric field so they can enter my Oreck space because they did not want to go in the shop bucket to be terminated good delicious host because I have a lot of pee a lot of energy I’m a Healer I’m pretty clear right they wanted to be in me because I was delicious. completed person bus driver okay let me jump in her so that’s only did it so when I had my session I have a weekly session with my healer because when I’m working with people that appear a vigilante at somebody who’s very careful and she was born clip why does always seeing your weather have cords attached from clients whether you know all the stuff she just keeps an eye on me right issues I’m working on my adrenals right now we’ve already cleaned up my thyroid who is related to multiple pass while I’m on my own healers if you’re not healing stuff then you should know if you don’t have it well I mean it’s also it’s also you have to be walking to talk I think I should be like healing that I have a Healer you know every week keeping an eye on me and she said she doesn’t really much larger package but she know she does it for a full-time job to do with something much more expensive and that’s okay you know it’s okay it’s all okay so I know I’ve been like oh my God she said I just looked at that went oh I don’t even know and then she goes well this is like way more serious and then because okay I want to see what’s hidden you know she went there and then she fell and Chico’s Carol what happened she said where you like really really upset or emotionally better have a fight with them they don’t know you know me I’m like and I seen a light state of bliss pretty much all the time and she said I know that’s you but I have to ask is only thing that would cause your outer or skin when you’re upset what could happen when I get the crystal guy that has created a chair in my outer Aura and in those entities jumped in and she goes absolutely and then to spell imbalance and you keep Snow you come here you want me to put you back together I do that because you’re in my face I have really no choice other than to ask you to leave and then and then right back into your pattern of abusing yourself and then this is the consequence you know cuz he said he was going to tell me that he saw and she teasing me right cuz sometimes he’s got transferred over he didn’t realize that this job with the sleep deprivation and all of that it’s like this you’re going to be like a walking tornado you know I like peanuts where we’re at and so that’s something that I’ve been in in the my own process of of my own work around here figuring what those things are with those tools are and Tom yeah like I said I’m not an expert but I can at least Point people in some directions so I guess what we’re looking at here is that there’s an underground space very intentional underground space that is more conducive to kind of freestyling or rolling your own ceremony and just holding the light and and letting those who it call who are called to it you know it could become integrated into keep it at the gala Therrien and flowing so that you don’t have cult of personality and politics and all of the scenester Hipster things coming in and that’s always up in it and has to be on guard against and whatnot so I see there’s that unfoldment in that development and then there’s people who are also working like say in the social work field who are informing their peers and colleagues in those sectors with these Neo shamanic techniques or nonviolent communication or your where it’s legal and accessible and permissible you know legally again to be able to put people on amor I guess like prisons prison you Lila has a very and I’ve done some I interviewed her in the past and I’m a big fan of what she’s doing and I know she has a strong background in clinical social work and is feeding back into that sector the wisdom of of the Amazon and and Beyond and so is that something that you have I just thought I remember reading somewhere you know or talk to you at some point about how this is this is like you could be hired by the more formal above ground and sectors of social work or Community work with where you can be brought in to bring some of the stuff that would normally be or I guess it’s just that it’s a very interesting Cutting Edge of an intersection and I if I’m not mistaken that’s that you you are like sort of partially in that world 2 of of social work or is that something I understand correctly yeah I’ll I will string this conversation back and see where where I where I am placed social work as well as all the modalities of counseling and healing you know like they are all part and parcel to supporting and upholding status quo capitalist system so I’m going to like you know like you know also haven’t been in the punk scene also had a big enough impact on my my party now 13 m in terms of healing these wounds we have to look at that and I we can’t we can’t say like that are healing is going to be independent of the world that is reeling and suffering from the continuation of this system as it is and so that’s where for me like bringing capitalism into the equation is is something that’s real tricky it’s something that I feel needs to be kind of understood. You know we we can’t just rely on having sting services that we can pay for because that creates a gap you know where some people are going to have accessible abilities to to the healing and others won’t and that’s that’s not healthy for anyone and and also that it doesn’t address the root cause of why we need social workers to begin with and why we need counseling and all of that so I really like the notion of cultural healing that’s where more where I would be comfortable in any way kind of looking at myself as any kind of healer I don’t think we we can really heal individuals that’s really something that you know a person will need to and it’s not like they can be facilitated to do their own healing work but nobody can fix us we have to fix ourselves that’s that’s more I think a more powerful Paradigm to be apart of but you know I I I have worked in the realm of I focused therapy and you know I have spent quite a bit of time around the spirit plant medicines and seeing how the plant medicines have assisted and I do I do continue continuously work to increase my knowledge and wisdom around working with us plants and and that also brings us back into that hole realm of discussion around you know ancestors and working with them or perhaps that’s something we haven’t really touched upon but maybe she said it’s just that in any form of healing that we do I guess for me the important thing that I really try to bring into whatever I do connecting back with her ancestors and healing the trauma of how we were disconnected from those ancestors and how that plays out in any kind of sexual wounds or emotional wounds that we carry and so that’s something that I I I feel like the role of initiation and ritual can can really do and that’s that’s been its Province ever since people began doing patrols I think it’s to build upon the legacy of their ancestors and to draw and their their help and support cool said that yeah thank you for helping me understand the other parameters a little better and and 100% there with you I have I have been because I live in the United States where there’s different laws around no prostitution in in how that affects the healing with sexual touch and pleasure as medicine and stuff like that is a lot more yes I understand in in Canada there’s there’s a lot more interesting legal space in order to do Hands-On Sexual Healing work relative to the US where it’s completely off limits in so I because of that adapting to that reality and also is a permaculture designer myself I have to think very deeply about how to navigate this issue of for-profit healing work that kind of in most sectors is about like you said I’ll put in my own words it’s like they want to know if if the if you’re at a time of time robot that supposed to be producing a set amount to be a productive member of the of the GDP then then if you’re not functioning properly than the the goal of the mainstream social work or psychotherapeutic or psychiatric Fields they’re trying to get you back into the rat race as soon as possible and they’ll do that with drugs with talk therapy or whatever that is about avoiding through tissue which is the disconnection from urethane from a healthy holistic wild habitat you know a night as a primitivist I see that you know the solution to your Neurosis is to retry belies and Get Growing your own food again in and rebuild that fabric so you know there with you on that tension about right livelihood in and taking money for healing and what is he doing so I really like what you said and that just is going to it’s going to help me a lot looking at healing the cultural level and healing the if I’m understanding right and I’ll put a couple my own words on it but I feel like we’re trying to build the scaffolding or were trying to design the context for people to take the responsibility of a personal healing and gone to that journey and so if you if what would you say are some practical skills are tools from all of your things that you would teaching and training and a things that you discovered in your own journey to where you’re in power tools for empowerment that you suggest or are resources that you suggest people Explorer to if they’re called to do the cultural healing work weather for profit or non-profit. Some dance between the two or it and then what what are some recommendations for people who are on their own path and aren’t necessarily called to do the the cultural healing yeah I mean it’s it’s a pretty vast subject that one but I think that a few points that I could think about and talk about our that I’m going to this idea of bringing you back in the station rights and recognizing that in the absence of them what do we have you know we are we are sadly in there without initiated Elders so many of us and if there are any of Elders that hold that ability to to guide those those ones are those are worth their weight in gold you know there really is people that we should try to lift up and and give them their recognition and see you know and then in the absence of that it’s like we kind of by default Our Generations people that will have to hopefully fulfill that and reach a place where we can actually help upcoming generations to go in a way that they don’t have to completely go it alone and and figure it out on them on their own the way that so many of us have had to and so there is a movement around Rites of Passage I sit on the board if you passageways which is a network that focus is squarely on you no Rites of Passage for you coming of age from all different walks and and and modalities you know some of them are our Boys to Men oriented some of them are girls to women some of them are starting to incorporate non gender binary kind of approaches as well which is good and and this whole focus on bringing back the ancestors into looking at Rites of Passage is is starting to happen and something that I focused on and so that’s that’s a resource you know people can go to youth passageways. Oregon and look at what programs are out there and they can also think about how they can add to that list and bring in things that are needed around especially around sexuality and relationship which is often I noticed kind of a big gap in a lot of programs out there you know because they’re confined confined or constrained by the conservative values where they take place and you know what school system is you know this is one of those places lagging for that kind of thing so it’s a role that I think that many people who understand the need can step into and cultivate as career paths you know and some people are pig figuring out how they can weave their credentials says on Sexual Health Educators or sexual therapist or sexual trauma or no trauma-based therapists you know into this realm of initiation and that’s that needs to happen on a on an increased level the other I see a lot of because of what I was saying around looks really don’t how many Avenues to learn other than through you know what the books in the workshops and offerings around sexuality thoughts unfortunately are not rooted in in people’s only need two lineages generally speaking you know so the whole Tantra movement is pretty much so you know a cultural appropriator of New Age fight version of those Traditions that would have been squashed by Christianity especially and so I think there’s work to be done there and as much as possible Retreat retrieving reconstructing are reconnecting with our own ancestral Traditions which I’m sure you know had their own knowledge wisdom around how to how to raise healthy harmonious individuals with healthy sexualities from from the vantage point of how what little I do know has been has been done in indigenous cultures and without wanting to appropriate for them from them I’ll just give way of examples out of that you know in and certain cultures that are studied like the Mayan culture and I think to some degree on certain places within Creek culture there’s examples of how as societies you know that the children are raised from an early age 2 reach a point where they understand how to how to harmonize with the other sex and how to to look after each other and that’s just a very basic principle that I feel like you know that’s that’s worth kind of learning how to integrate into our family structures if we have children that were raising just to keep in mind that you know there is a need for them to learn skills around things like consent and around being responsible with with one’s sexual energies and and I needs to start before they reach that age of adolescence where they’re just harder to connect with if you haven’t built up that Foundation so that’s something that I think about will do you so if I if if we check out that the organization that you mention is it would that be good place to find and something like a more enlightened or more conscious like sexual education curriculum or guidebook do you know if people were working on something like that so if I know if you know parents who were going through the puberty of their child that they have something that’s not just this cold clinical Western and even though that sort of evolving a little bit you know with things like a sack didn’t and whatnot I see a lot but the The ancestral wisdom and you know the ceremonial Rites of Passage you know how does it how does the Modern Family say okay well you’re about to start feeling you know hormonal Energy’s how do we give you know create even if it’s just within their family or their Community yoga or whatever is something more than what’s being offered in the normal sex ed or what they’re listening in gangster rap music and watching on sitcoms obviously you know it’s enough for lack of lot of alternative options it’s one one place to look and we’re always looking for others so whenever we discover something then we will see to auditory resources and we are trying to vet those resources and those organizations to make sure that they really are you know at least there’s some some level of you know safe recommendation that we can give for those those organizations we’re not we’re not in the position to really kind of completely you know set standards but we are trying to we have a code of what we call it a cross-cultural protocol so we do look at that aspect that you have for what we’re talking about that’s you know if that’s another layer that we will hopefully get to eventually and I do know that there are people within our Network who are really strongly focused on this particularly around girls to women kind of education and and Rites of Passage and some of the Boys to Men once but I think it’s also something we need to to enhance as well oh that’s great yeah that’s that’s that’s what I wanted to hear so that I can just refer people to this ongoing and so and then the LSI is kind of its there’s a Facebook I’ve been interacting with the the Facebook group for a while so is that something you recommend people plug-in I mean that’s the goal of that is to feature blogs and generate discussions from those blogs and also to establish a resource of services as well as information and so that’s you know running on in a very limited volunteer capacity and so you know it’s something that I hope will eventually become a very powerful resource but already it’s you know it’s been feedback that I’ve received that you know even just the the group that we have on Facebook somebody posted recently. You know it’s really help them in their in their path which is nice to hear and I’ve heard that a few times and I try to curate that group in such a way where it’s like you know it’s trying to generate discussion and it’s it’s trying to be a safe space where where people can get into some of those I’m intimate revealing is of what what’s going on in their lives one of the things that kind of came out of love sex intelligence local as a connection with Tamara and the love school that they have which is a very congruence philosophy to love sex intelligence and they’re their work to try to create or with to create safe spaces for people to to share stories of what’s going on in their intimate lover sexual lives and and B witnessed in a way that is non-judgemental where they’re not being flooded with advice but more just being witnessed which is kind of connected to that whole framework for Rites of Passage itm witnessing each other and so it’s it’s trying to also look at how you know communities can succeed in their in their goals which might include you know like being more sustainable or being an alternative to the systems around us and also being a part of a more peaceful kind of culture through filling this hole that is often where things go wrong where people are are are not feeling safe to talk about these these human experiences around wounding around are our hearts and our sexuality so I’ve been part of a Practice Group here that has been circulating also to other parts of BC and I think it’s a really it’s a really powerful movement to be a part of yeah we’re getting close to an hour or so I have to take a few more minutes and I’m get a couple thoughts and feelings some responsible for 1 something that his is coming up for me that I think it’s really empowering is this like idea that wouldn’t it be nice if some of us started to think of ourselves as aspiring Elders I’ve never thought of it that way until this conversation and there’s a little spark of joy and me that that says you know puts in context the the punk rock lifestyle that I had of live fast Die Young and just you know if it’s not throwing yourself into the meat grinder of insurrectionary activism you know with this sort of Death Wish you know this martyr complex or whatever it’s like those are really unsustainable archetypes to follow and they leave a lot of people when they get to my age in about 35 like in a sort of existential crisis that will the revolution didn’t happen and I didn’t get killed I didn’t die in the gutter you know I mean what am I going to do now and it’s like well maybe it’s time to become an aspiring Elder and you know clean up your act and and then start to think about how you’re going to make it easier cuz I there’s a lot of things that I had to go through that I would seriously love to have no one else ever have to go through and if you know if we can live in that. you know that is what you’re supposed to think that I think of you say you know you can you can learn from the wisdom of Elders who have gone through and made the mistakes that you’re probably going to go through or you can just be hard-headed and learn all your lessons the hard way but I mean we’ve had to learn a lot of hard lessons in the absence of the eldership but I think if we take on that there’s a yeah me too. It seems obvious but really the way you put it his medicine for me to think you know it’s a dignified path to be an aspiring Elder and then it makes you not be so how do I can help you defeat that that that grinding pressure that oh my I’m going to lose my looks and I’m going to lose my energy and I’m going to be in the state of deprecation towards death and that’s very much the greatest fear of the western manicured Uno photoshopped airbrushed identity like you’re not really giving any hope that aging will be of any benefit in here just marginalized further and further so I thank you for that serve very much still give that time sacred eldership dignity not a light title to hold I think the true Elder wouldn’t really feel comfortable in it cuz it’s defining attributes of an elder that is really one that can help that role be the best it can be is one that is is really accountable is really present isn’t so on the move that if you can’t you know be relied upon to be there for the people that it serves now needs to ideally be in the in the fellowship of other Elders to kind of keep it in in in check in a way like we have to watch for the Cole group kind of phenomenon where people you know place a lot of weight on that person and in a way that can privilege them in certain ways and also lead to potential like power distortions and things like that you know it’s it’s only human that people will make mistakes and so having that kind of accountability of other people and also that time yeah you have people heart or a different there’s always like in every phase of life with the lifecycle there’s there’s like the maturing phases and so there’s like you know there’s a baby elder there’s enough adult Elder and then Senior Elder and so it’s just we have to learn at each stage of Life how to become the mature version of what that stage is and says just something to think about as well and it’s good to to get your feet wet early on in life so that you know we can have deep roots and and the and those are the kinds of people to like in the Tamara situation out of the black community they have a circle of Elders who are basically people who have grown with a community enough that they know the people in their community and then they serve a role as potential kind of like the Matchmaker but you know in a way where people can approach them in and ask them like you know I’m interested in this person and they can help you assess whether this is the right time or what is a good or bad idea and you know they can kind of that. Whole courtship in a way that you know really I think I wish there were more of those people around here don’t you let me relax you know learn the hard way what does that we’re just not compatible certain people in The Matrix the I mean yeah I’m not I’m not a political scientist of the Matrix but I will say that what got me peaked on the ecstatic trance dance group ritual ceremony festival thing was it really when I saw I think it was maybe the second movie or maybe it was the second or the third but there was a scene where they’re just getting down to like Juno Reactor I think was a soundtrack of a butt there is something beautiful about seeing the different the warrior culture Guided by elders and of course there’s different the archetypes playing out in Conflict split that to me was took it further than then the Star Trek Federation is a futuristic Elder guided Council guided kind of reality so that was kind of fun but yeah so that’s what came to mind when you’re at we’re talking about that be so cool if you’re early sexual oracle’s who you go to you know if we’re going to give you insights and maybe even have name your child for you or something cool like that you know be so cool but right on then will I worry about at the hours so do you have any closing touch you want to share or any other resources or should we just I’ll post the the links that you mention and I’ll definitely encourage people to stay informed and keep an eye out for your anything coming up you have any appearances or anything exciting like that coming up you want to mention I think yeah I think I covered a lot of it and I just wanted to maybe plant a seed while I have the airwaves here about something that I’d I’d eventually like to work on presenting which is around insert Intercultural relationships and also decolonizing our relationships as well and just thinking about how how we can heal some of these ancestral traumas and use that has as as a means to strengthen our relationships and also our society right on I’ll be looking forward to everything that you’re you’re expressing in the world and I hopefully yeah maybe sometime in the future we can talk about skill sets for Beyond Christian monogamy that would be a great topic so yeah how would you feel about that maybe we can sometime in the next few months follow up with something like that. Maybe by the by the time I’ll have more of a personal lived experience to a base conversation around that I think you know in terms of people who are already I don’t know how many listeners here are on a Christian spiritual path without that many but if the energy and gnosticism and sacred marriage not going to the alchemical top in the in the Gnostic tradition but I I wouldn’t make any claims to be an expert in that area but it’s definitely something to look at cool alright then we will be in touch and will follow up sometime in the future and thank you so much so be I really enjoyed it and I know it’s taking us a while to get this to get this done but I think it was perfect and I couldn’t ask for anything more so you have a wonderful day. Take care and keep for listening to the touch upon podcast please go to www.crunch.com and cook on the Donate button to help support the show in addition is to see me and if you want a podcast for donations will help establish permaculture goddess Temple every bite ecological employment for single mothers Please Subscribe and share your favorite episodes if you have questions or comments feel free to leave a voicemail at 818-275-1593 or email been at Contra Punk. Com Thomas Day